SPEAKER_02 0:05

I was probably one of five people that ever read the Buffy the Vampire Slayer young adult novelization of the Buffy the Vampire Slayer movie, which was a moderately successful movie that would one day sp uh create a much more successful movie.

SPEAKER_01 0:20

They probably talked about you in like their like marketing meetings, like, you know, that kid that has to do a book report in the fourth grade. I just remember like he's gonna happen on it. Yeah. I read the whole thing. Yep. So this is not that kind of uh this is not that kind of book report, but this is Bible study. Welcome back to the Bible study podcast.

SPEAKER_02 0:39

To the Bible study podcast. We are Go ahead. Acts four, right? Yep. Okay, cool. Cool. So we're going through the book of Acts. Last week, you and Thomas.

SPEAKER_01 0:48

Yep, me and Thomas read about um the lame man being healed, where he like asks for some money and Peter says, I'll give you something better. Yeah, we don't have any money, but what we do have, we'll give you. And he stands up and is healed. And so this is kind of like the follow-up and aftermath of the people that just watched that happen.

SPEAKER_02 1:06

They're all like Boy, you gotta be honest, like that is that is some confidence.

SPEAKER_01 1:11

Very confident.

SPEAKER_02 1:12

I mean, it's like obviously it was a move of God, but also it requires the person who's doing it to say that confidently. Because there's a way to do that where you just pray and then you open your eyes, like you silently pray that the person's healed, and then you open your eyes to see if it happened. Yep.

SPEAKER_01 1:26

But when you say that on the front end, yeah, that's what we talked about, is like the faith it takes to do that, the fact that Jesus still heals, but also I feel like I've prayed those prayers in faith and haven't seen people do it.

SPEAKER_02 1:38

So it's a tough, it's an interesting thing.

SPEAKER_01 1:40

We cracked it open, but Acts chapter four. Let's read a section and then we'll talk about it. Uh Acts four, one. And as they were speaking to the people, the priests and the captain of the temple and the Sadducees came upon them, greatly annoyed because they were teaching the people and proclaiming in Jesus the resurrection from the dead. And they arrested them and had and put them in custody until the next day, for it was already evening. But many of those who had heard the word believed, and the number of the men came to about five thousand. On the next day their rulers and elders and scribes gathered together in Jerusalem, with Annas the high priest, and Caiaphas, and John and Alexander, and all who were of the high priestly family. And when they had set them in the midst, they inquired, By what power or by what name did you do this? Then Peter, filled with the Holy Spirit, said to them, Rulers and people and elders rulers of the people and elders, if we are being examined today concerning a good deed done to a crippled man, by what means this man has been healed, let it be known to all of you, and to all the people of Israel that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom you crucified, whom God raised from the dead, by him this man is standing before you well. Do you want to stop there? I mean, we can keep going and read this whole next chunk.

SPEAKER_02 3:05

No, we can stop there. Yeah, so we'll get back on verse 11. Yeah, so this is more where he goes into like theological. Yeah, he discussed this. Yeah. Um, yeah, this is a crazy, this is a really cool scene.

SPEAKER_01 3:18

So Sadducees annoy are they're greatly annoyed because they were proclaiming the resurrection of the dead.

SPEAKER_02 3:25

So Pharisees and Sadducees, that's the major thing they disagreed on. I mean, they disagreed on other things. Sure. But the Pharisees believed in life after death. The Sadducees did not believe in any life after death. Right. And Jesus has a pretty like interesting moment where he is confronted by the Sadducees and he says, like, have you never read the scriptures kind of thing? I'm I'm I haven't read it preparing for this, but just my brain. Um, so I'm probably gonna get wrong a little bit. But he says, Well, he is the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. He's the God of the living, not the dead. Right. And that would have been a way that like no one would have ever thought of that scripture before. But it's just shows the the brilliance of Jesus and the the the deeper is he's saying that well, Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob still are. Right. Right?

SPEAKER_01 4:09

Like he's not they're they're alive right now.

SPEAKER_02 4:11

Right. The God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, like any the old testament says that a lot. Um and it's like, well, when he says basically, I guess like every time God says that in the old testament, it's like in the present tense. Like I'm the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. And they've always thought about the God of, you know, the dead guys. Yeah. And it was just like, ah.

SPEAKER_01 4:30

And so to say, like, that you'll have a resurrection life in that context, this is like stirring up that debate.

SPEAKER_02 4:38

There's not I mean, look, the uh it's that idea of like progressive revelation, right? Where God sort of he just reveals things slowly throughout the course of of the scriptures. There is not really an old testament theology that's clearly laid out about life after death. Now there are moments where you see I mean it was Job, right? He says if whether or not I could know there was life after death. But there wasn't this deep faith of it's okay, I'm I'm going to a better place. That that's not really a concept. In fact, that's a concept that other like belief systems had. Right. And some who some who would be critical would say, like, oh, the Bible just co-opted this other major religion's, you know, Christianity or or Judaism just co-opted this other religion's idea of the afterlife and stamped Christianity on it. Not true. Um, because even in the Old Testament, you have It's like these pictures of what it's supposed to be, where it's all moving toward.

SPEAKER_01 5:33

But like you're saying progressive revelation means the what's being revealed to you is progressing as revelation of God.

SPEAKER_02 5:40

Yeah, it's it's bit it's not revealed all at once, and then you unpack it, it's revealed bit by bit. And so the time you get to Jesus, there's serious debate about whether or not there is life after death, if there's resurrection of the dead. Um the Sadducees held strongly that there is no resurrection of the dead.

SPEAKER_01 5:55

And are Sadducees just like compare them in is there like a modern equivalent of like what this would be? Is just like do they have power in the temple? Are they like most power? So they are like in charge of what? Like they're administering the same thing. So the Sadie.

SPEAKER_02 6:12

The Sadducees were much more um the f the Sadducees would have looked at the Pharisees as the fanatical fundamentalists that are like take everything way too seriously. Okay. The Sadducees would have, as a whole, like the Sanhedrin, um, that that would have been mainly Sadducees. Gotcha. And the Sadducees were a Jewish religious group. They were much more politically influential, much more wealthy, much more tied into the like political power structures of Rome.

SPEAKER_01 6:44

So because of the Roman occupation, basically a religious group has the opportunity to have political power. Like because Rome's like, we'll work together with you if you keep these people in line, that sort of thing.

SPEAKER_02 6:58

Yeah, and the Sadducees were just a little I mean, uh if you on a modern basis, people would have said that they're much more liberal in terms of their how fast how tightly they held to their beliefs in terms of the scriptures. Um not trying to say liberal, like all those.

SPEAKER_01 7:14

They wouldn't have aligned with all of the same.

SPEAKER_02 7:16

And they would have they would have looked at the Pharisees as much more conservative in that they're trying to like stay true to this.

SPEAKER_01 7:22

Retaining the exact version of the scriptures.

SPEAKER_02 7:25

So they're more progressive and they were much more uh okay with the Roman occupation, they were aligned with Rome. Um they were not looking to upset they the Sadducees would not have been looking to overthrow Rome because they in fact they benefited greatly from Rome. They they had power and influence and wealth.

SPEAKER_01 7:43

So the Jesus movement that's happening is not just like threatening to like we disagree with you. Like you say that there's after life after death, we say that there's not life after death. Yes. This is like you forming a coalition threatens the ability for us to rule you consistently.

SPEAKER_02 8:00

Yeah, you've got really four main groups in Israel at this time. You have the Essenes, which are the no the her the hermits who leave to go into the desert. They're like the Dead Sea Scroll people.

SPEAKER_01 8:11

That's why we have them preserved because they were in the room.

SPEAKER_02 8:13

Because they just dry copies and copies, and and they don't really get involved in anything. Then you have the Sadducees, politically influential, very wealthy, very influential people. Um they they tended to make up the majority of the ruling, the ones that really had authority, and they're much more aligned with Rome. You have the Pharisees who are much more hardcore theological fundamentalists in terms of their faith in Judaism. They're the ones that are like, at this point in time, they're they're writing all the extra rules that are gonna be layered on top of the law to make sure that everyone follows the law. Gotcha. And then you have the zealots who are the extremely political revolutionaries. I mean, and the zealots are probably more aligned with the Pharisees than the Sadducees, but the the Zealots are like, no, we're gonna go kill the Romans.

SPEAKER_01 8:56

Conflict with Rome is how we resolve this.

SPEAKER_02 8:58

Yes, they are they are the freedom fighters, is how they would have viewed themselves, and others would have called them terrorists.

SPEAKER_01 9:02

So And then in that mix is the Christians, and that's what's interesting. Uh the verse 14.

SPEAKER_02 9:07

They don't know, no one knows what to do with them. Right, right.

SPEAKER_01 9:10

But the Christians probably would have been like made up of a lot of those groups, like some of those connected groups as well, because it says many of those who had heard the word believed. And the number of men came about to about 5,000. And so it's like in the mix of all of that, it's like your buddy who used to be like a hardcore Sadducee has changed his mind potentially. Yeah. You know, like we don't know all the details of who was who and who converted to Christianity and how what the we don't know the breakdown.

SPEAKER_02 9:37

Well, it's like 20% Sadducees, exactly Pharisees. No, I mean it's it's just it's an interesting makeup at that era. But what's in what I think's really interesting about it is what did unite many of them together was we got to deal with this Jesus problem. You know, and you actually see that even in the Bible, the Pharisees go and they they go meet with the Herodians, meaning those are like the people from Herod's, you know, the Herod's people. They they would have I mean they could not they hated Herod and all that Herod stood for. And yet we got to deal with this Jesus problem. You know, the my the enemy of my enemy is my friend kind of thing. And so, yeah, these are people that disagreed and they debated about all kinds of things, but they definitely they definitely united under the banner of we've got to do something about Jesus, and now it's his followers. Yeah. Because you know, killing him didn't squash it, didn't do anything because of that whole pesky resurrection from the dead business.

SPEAKER_01 10:30

Exactly. And it's interesting too that this is like a fulfillment of a promise um from Jesus because they're arrested. And then the way go ahead.

SPEAKER_02 10:41

I probably got some details. Like if someone's a a genuine scholar, this is all kind of off the head.

SPEAKER_01 10:46

This is a loose Bible study. And me and uh Thomas talked about it last week. Like part of I think the benefit of doing this live and not having like a hyper research to detailed preparedness. I didn't spend hours, yeah. Right. Part of it is like as a Christian, when you approach the Bible, there's gonna be stuff you know and there's gonna be stuff you don't know. And it's okay to ask the question even if it feels dumb, or to say something that is like, I'm pretty sure that's right, but I'm not positive, and then process it out. So absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 11:13

But I but I mean I'm I'm I definitely, those four categories, I'm not confused on that. But uh, but yeah, yeah, and so here they are, and there's 5,000. And but Jesus and his followers are still a big problem, and these are the heavy hitters right here. I mean, you're talking the high priest. I mean, this is a extremely, extremely wealthy, powerful family, because the high priest really, by this point in time, it was really a family affair, like one family for generations. It's yes situation. It is, it's the religious mafia. Um, and so these are just I mean, these are people who could have had audience with the emperor in Rome.

SPEAKER_01 11:51

I mean, it's kind of crazy to just not saying that they would have had like the emperors do whatever they want, sure.

SPEAKER_02 11:56

But this if if the emperor would have heard that Annas the high priest is in town, Annas could have dined with the emperor had he viewed it as politically uh wise to do so.

SPEAKER_01 12:08

Yeah, and they so they get arrested. Yep, and like I said, Jesus promised that, hey, when you get arrested, don't worry about what to say. For the Holy Spirit will give you words.

SPEAKER_02 12:19

And then here it happens.

SPEAKER_01 12:19

Yeah, verse 7, the end half of it, it's by what power or name did you do this? And Peter, filled with the Holy Spirit, said to them, Rulers of the people, are we being accused because this guy was healed? And so then it goes, then he goes to explain basically like we did this in the name of Jesus, but here's how Jesus fits into your story, which is a really cool thing. So we'll just keep reading.

SPEAKER_02 12:42

No, and I love by the way that he throws in that that man you crucified. Yep, it's an accusation. But it is. There's a there's a boldness there, and I mean we're gonna talk about this, I'm sure, but it's not that it was not that long ago that Peter was denying that he knew Jesus out of fear of these exact same people. Like when Jesus was that the when when Peter denied that he knew Jesus, he was Peter was eavesdropping on the sham of a trial that Jesus was put under uh by like the high priest. Yeah. So like I'm pretty certain I gotta get.

SPEAKER_01 13:13

Paiaphas is like mentioned in there.

SPEAKER_02 13:14

Yeah, that the some of these guys were at that trial, and Peter at that trial, just a matter of months ago, was so afraid of these men that he's like, I've never even heard of this Jesus guy, and he curses the name of him. He's like, You're the one who killed him. Yeah. And now he's now it's like, what has changed? Right. The Holy Spirit. Yeah. It's really cool. All right, keep going.

SPEAKER_01 13:31

So he says, This Jesus, verse 11, this Jesus is the stone that was rejected by you, the builders, which has become the cornerstone, and there's salvation in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved. Now, when they saw the boldness of Peter and John and perceived that they were uneducated common men, they were astonished, and they recognized that they had been with Jesus.

SPEAKER_02 13:55

My my translation, I'm reading New Living, which is more it says, uh ordinary men with no special training.

SPEAKER_01 14:01

There you go.

SPEAKER_02 14:02

I love that.

SPEAKER_01 14:03

Uh but seeing the man who was healed standing beside them, they had nothing to say in opposition. But when they had commanded them to leave the council, they conferred with one another, saying, What shall we do with these men? For that no uh for that a notable sign has been performed through them is is evident to all the inhabitants of Jerusalem, and we cannot deny it. But in order that it may not spread that it may spread no further among the people, let us warn them to speak no more to anyone in his name. So they called them and charged them not to speak or teach at all in the name of Jesus. But Peter and John answered them, Whether it is right for in the sight of God to listen to you rather than to God, you must judge. For we cannot cannot speak but what we have seen and heard. And when they had further threatened them, they let them go, finding no way to punish them, because of the people, for all were praising God for what had happened. For the man who to on whom this sign of healing was performed was more than forty years old. Pause there. I love it. Whether it's right in the sight of God to listen to you or to listen to God, you judge for yourself.

SPEAKER_02 15:16

Yeah. Translation, we're not gonna stop talking about Jesus.

SPEAKER_01 15:20

Exactly. Have you ever been like either overtly or subtly like asked to tone it down on the Jesus stuff?

SPEAKER_02 15:30

I mean, I've worked at a church since I was 23. Right. So that's been pretty nice. Um college, I think that, you know, uh I went to a it's funny, I went to a college that traditionally had been a Christian college. I mean, actually most colleges were. Like Duke University started off as a seminary, and it's amazing how many of the colleges we have in America. Now they're the blue devils. Now they're the blue devils. Uh but like I'm saying that like early colleges, not state schools, but early colleges very often started with deeply Christian education. Christian education kind of things. And so then obviously whatever. But the school I went to had actually, just a few years before I got there, been like kicked out of the whatever denominational association they had. It was something related to Baptist, but they had been given the boot because they were they weren't, you know, they weren't doing things the right way. And I I will say, like it can sound cliche, but I will say like there was there was definitely a I I would honestly just say a a concerted effort on behalf of most of my uh professors to get students to deconstruct their faith in Christianity, not anything else. Right. It would it classes I would have that had nothing to do with I mean I took I o I was one class away from being a religion minor. I took that many religion classes and I kind of didn't finish it just to kind of I was a little bit of a pest. But but I literally got called in. So so here's what happened for me. I I had a um even though the school was was no longer directly Christian, they still had some organizations on campus that were I was very involved in that. And they had a religion department and they had chapels that you could go to. It was it was kind of a weird thing. Um so it was in this interesting time of the pendulum swinging, the pendulum swinging, the we've been kicked out, and a lot of our professors are like, Oh, you believe the Bible? Even the religion professors, you know, if it was about it was basically like let's undermine the Bible. That was the goal very much felt. I was pretty outspoken, and uh I got called into the head of the religion department's office when I was a junior and told that I needed to get out of the shallow end of the theological pool, is what I was told. Dr. Dr. Pratt was his name. And he the man he had no neck. Chris Pratt's dad. Chris Pratt's dad. He had I just remember the the way he was built, he always wore a suit and tie, and there was no discernible neck. It was just shoulders and a head. Um and so I'm looking at you know, shoulders and head, and he's telling me I gotta cool it. And I wasn't I wasn't disruptive in class, but I would challenge. And I would it's funny, I would challenge, and what I would look at is um a mixture of youthful arrogance, and like I I definitely enjoyed You like the argument for arrogant. I like I did, and but also I would hear these professors say things very matter-of-factly, and they they would bring up some type of gotcha, like, oh, the b read this verse in the Bible, guys.

unknown 18:25

Right.

SPEAKER_02 18:26

Contradiction. And then I would go back and research, and I'm like, well, this has been something that's been talked about for thousands of years, and oh, here's this entire volumes of it's not not even that hard to pick it apart.

SPEAKER_01 18:37

Correct.

SPEAKER_02 18:37

And like, oh, there's volumes of really uh reasonable, substantial like counterpoint to what they said, but they wouldn't ever bring any of that up. They would pretend like they're the ones that found it, and then they just drop it. And the average 18-year-old kid who grew up in church but hasn't ever read his Bible would be like, oh no, my faith is a complete crime. And I had a lot of kids I knew than friends, it's a smaller school, that really by the time they were seniors in high school didn't believe in God anymore, right? So it's like the the religion department produces atheists, right? Like that's what we we take Christians and we make them atheists seriously. And so I I would have arguments and I would say, Hey, listen, you said this last you know class, but but you know, what about this and what about that? And I got called into the office of the guy, and he said, you know, cool it, you're you're uh and he preframed it for me like I was just too shallow theologically, I needed to become enlightened. Um and I think I if I'm if I okay, I'm just gonna be honest. I either said this or I thought of saying it and wished I would have, because it's kind of like I either said it or I wanted to so badly.

SPEAKER_01 19:40

Whether it's right to listen in the sight of God.

SPEAKER_02 19:43

I said I'd rather I'd I think I'd rather swim in the shallow end than drown in the deep. Oh, nice. If that's what you consider the deep. Like is what I said. And I do believe I said that because I was pretty like I had actually had a reputation for being the thorn in the religion department side. I kept taking their classes. Yeah. And all that. But um, that's the closest I've had. Yeah. And I wasn't threatened with a beating. I wasn't threatened with expulsion even. I was just kind of like reprimanded. I was intellectually bullied. Yeah. And I think I said something like, Well, if that's what you think the deep end is, I'd rather I'd rather swim in the shallow end than drown in the deep. And then I went off and that's fair. Yeah. But I may have not said that. Yeah. And I just remember I wanted to built up in your mind. In my years, I should have said that to now I like crazy. So much show me a video, like, you didn't say that. I was like, well, I said it in my mind. Yeah. I think I did, though. I actually think I did, because Dr. Pratt never really talked to me after that. There you go.

SPEAKER_01 20:35

But I think it lends itself to the point of them being uneducated common men or men without training. It's like the disciples, what did the disciples have as an advantage over other people to speak so boldly? It's a combination of the Holy Spirit and having spent time with the people. We walked with Jesus. Yeah. We were there. And there's not there's not this like pressure to um, you know, when when Jesus hands the keys to the kingdom to Peter and renames him Peter from Simon. There isn't this like after you complete your training. It's like, no, you've you've recognized me for who I am. Right. I'm giving you this authority. Yep. This is going to come with so much more into the future. But it's not like, and you'll you'll get some extra training on the way. And once you get the certificate, then you'll be able to lead in the way that you need to lead. And that's not to bash people who have certificates and who value the study of scripture so much that they would go to school for it, but to say that it's not this requirement for doing what's right. And I think Peter's really cool for doing that. Yeah. Anything else from this little section? No, I think that's great. Cool. All right, next next little section. Um, verse twenty three. When they were released, they went to their friends and reported what the chief priests and elders had said to them. And when they heard it, they lifted their voices together to God and said, Sovereign Lord, who made the heaven and the earth. And the sea and everything in them, who through the mouth of our father David, your servant, said by the Holy Spirit, Why did the Gentiles rage and the peoples plot in vain? The kings of the earth set themselves, and the rulers were gathered together against the Lord and against his anointed. For truly in this city there were gathered together against your holy servant Jesus, whom you anointed, both Herod and Pontius Pilate, along with the Gentiles and the peoples of Israel, to do whatever your hand and your plan had predestined to take place. And now, Lord, look upon their threats and grant to your servants to continue to speak your word with all boldness, while you stretch out your hand to heal, and signs and wonders are performed through the name of your holy servant Jesus. And when they had prayed, the place in which they were gathered was together, was shaken, and they were all filled with the Holy Spirit, and continued to speak the word of God with boldness. I mean, yeah, that's a good that's crazy.

SPEAKER_02 23:04

Well, this kind of happens, this is a theme we're gonna see in Acts where like someone will go to prison, get arrested, they'll be released. This happens even the shaking, you know, it happens where uh they're they're in prison and the the chains fall off as everything shakes. Then they go back to where the believers are meeting, they share their testimony, everyone's like, oh my gosh, God is amazing and this is real, and then it's powerful, and then you know, things happen. This is just a uh that is an interesting you know, there there are some who believe that the Holy Spirit doesn't operate like this anymore. Okay. Um that this was a because they'll look and go, well, why isn't that happening now? Why when's the last time you were in a church service and the whole place shook because the Holy Spirit was there and then then that guy just got healed? And then there are places that there are lots of reports of that happening, and I've definitely believed that, and I've seen I I I bel I would say confident to say I have seen people healed. Right. Okay. But it hasn't been in a church service where it was like stand up now. You know what I mean? I don't know. Yeah. Um and then there's versions of that that are really that get extreme.

SPEAKER_01 24:09

And one and then there's like the documentation of that there's fake versions. Yeah, it becomes fakey.

SPEAKER_02 24:13

Correct. And there's people out there that are grifters that charlatans that basically pretend to be healers and use and there have been many documented cases of this, use all kinds of trickery to scam people out of money and all that kind of stuff. It's a lot, it's a lot. Um but and so the reason there's some will say that that doesn't happen anymore, which I don't believe, is because it seems like it happens in such a concentrated way here. Like it's just like every day, like that guy gets healed, and that person's healed, and miracles are happening, and you know, and at the very least, I think you can say that the Holy Spirit was uh highly active among these people in this.

SPEAKER_01 24:50

Which we have kind of a precedent for God's activity in the world coming in waves and coming like there's like, oh, a round of prophets happen during a certain time in Israel's history, and then there's like a round of well, there's four hundred years in between the prophets and Jesus.

SPEAKER_02 25:06

Exactly. Yeah, and there's clearly times in the Bible like what happened to the Israelites in the desert where it's raining food every day. Exactly. Just keep them around. It's like, well, then one day that stopped. Yeah. And it'd been really nice if it just keeps raining food every day. You know what I mean? We don't have to grow it. We don't have to, but nope, that stopped. Um and so yeah, God can come in waves, but I think what you don't do is say, well, it doesn't seem like that's happening in my time. So it can never happen. So it's it's done. Yeah. Because if you if you don't if you believe it's done, it's really easy to justify why you don't have those experiences. Right. But if it can happen, it just hasn't in your life. Well, is there is there a chance that you're not sure.

SPEAKER_01 25:44

Yeah, there's like an inherent challenge in that to say, like, I need to draw near to the Lord and trust him to provide in ways that he has provided before.

SPEAKER_02 25:55

Um and like encourage is an interesting word because we usually use encouragement in the sense of like I don't know, like accomplishments. Yeah. But they need courage, right? Like they need to go out and be bold. And it what helps you be bold? Oh, God did that. I'm I'm pretty bold about it.

SPEAKER_01 26:10

So and that perspective, too, to like have to do whatever you're like there was Pilate, there were the Gentiles, there was Herod. All of that was predestined to take place. Like, even the worst of what we remember, all of that took place so that your plan could come about. And now we're experiencing threats. And you can imagine, like, being a Christian in that early generation, like in a ton of ways, there is like a direct mirroring of the persecution that Jesus went through that's in the living memory of these people and what you're experiencing. And you know, it says to take up your cross and follow me, Jesus does, or to bear your bird to bear your cross. I wonder like how directly they like had that in their mind to go like, oh yeah, like Caiaphas threatened Jesus too. If Jesus can do it, I have the Holy Spirit, I can I could endure it too. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 27:03

And and again, I think it's important to keep looking at the I think it said this in the first one. Some people have called this the gospel of the Holy Spirit. Like, look at it and see the Holy Spirit as the main character, as the main actor. And you do see it here, like Peter, filled with the Holy Spirit, says this. Yep. And the place shook because they were filled with the Holy Spirit. Yep. And so here the Holy Spirit keeps going. And then this just kind of leads to the close, which is how they're living their lives, kind of indicate uh similar to Acts chapter two.

SPEAKER_01 27:26

Yep, you know. So it says, verse 32 Now the full number of those who believed were of one heart and soul, and no one said any of the things that belonged to him was his own, but they had everything in common. And with great power the apostles were giving their testimony to the resurrection of the Lord Jesus, and great grace was upon them all. There was not a needy person among them, for as many as were owners of land or houses, sold them and brought the proceeds of what was sold, and laid it at the apostles' feet, and it was distributed to each to each as any needed. Thus Joseph, who is also called by the apostles Barnabas, which means son of encouragement, a Levite, a native of Cyprus, sold a field that belonged to him and brought the money and laid it at the apostles' feet. Which is kind of like foreshadowing for the next chapter.

SPEAKER_02 28:16

Yes, yeah. There's going to be other stories of fields being sold.

SPEAKER_01 28:20

Selling a field. Yeah. But I like too the the notable, the notable gift. Like it's kind of a funny, you know, being around church. Yeah, there's there's been notable gifts. Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_02 28:31

I would say so in the history of our, you know, we're not a um we don't what's the right word? How would you describe it? We don't publicize that stuff. Well, we we talk every week. We say, hey, thank you for giving, and here's the ways you can give, but we don't do we we're not a church that frequently does giving drives and giving initiatives. Trevor Burrus, Jr.

SPEAKER_01 28:52

Right. So we're not telling like the giving stories all that much as a way to illustrate the things because that's ultimately a private thing. It is a private thing.

SPEAKER_02 29:00

But and here what I will say is like our budget, our day-to-day expenses, which would include, you know, our staff salaries and operating costs and and all of that, the the normal giving, just the general giving here covers that. And if um but there have probably been five or six people total who are the reason, sole reason that we are in a healthy place financially. And we're and we're not just it's not it hasn't been like paycheck to paycheck sort of thing. I mean, and and there have been seasons where it is, but these are not like but but there's like there's certain families here who, yeah, like they have they have given so substantially here of their own accord, not because we asked them to, not because we we pitched them, but because they are like God has given me this and I want to bless my church with it. And yeah, there's a lot that we owe them. In fact, so one of the when you were the youth pastor, you came to me with this idea for a big expansion of our outdoor space. And I was like, at first, hey man, that's really expensive. Right. Because it was a lot of concrete and re- It would be like digging into the savings. It was it was like we gotta really know that this is from God. Well, uh maybe two weeks after you presented that to me, a guy came and he gave, I mean, almost not to the penny, but it was like the general what you would naturally round up to if you were gonna say how much does that project cost? Like this. This many thousand. He gave that same exact amount. And I got excited because I just as the person who leads the church, it's always exciting for me to have extra in savings because it just feels nice. Right. It's like it just feels like a genetic, yeah. Yeah. Um but then it was like God was like, hey, you know, you did just have one of your people on staff come to you with this idea that and I love the idea, it was great. It is and it did significantly revolutionize the issue. And so uh I remember calling that guy and saying, Hey, I just want you to know what this is gonna go toward because we actually just had this idea, and it's something Madison's really confident in, I'm really confident in, and one of the the only reason we said no to it was because we just don't have the funds right now to justify that, and then it just so happens that you gave and it was like that's what we needed. Seems like maybe that's a god thing. Yeah. Um, and we prayed about obviously and all that. But like, yeah, um, there have been people here who are the reason that we're able to do more than just keep the lights on.

SPEAKER_01 31:25

I think too, like there's like the big financial notable gifts, but then it's this idea of they all had like they were all had everything in common. And so there's how many more times has there been maybe not the notable gift like Barnabas with the field, but like you can drive my truck for the week because it's just sitting in my crash in my house, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 31:47

Yeah, we've we've got it, we've got a gentleman here this week, we won't name names, but who's been a bunch of people on staff have taken like a unique interest in and helped him get a job and helped him have a place to stay and helped him have transportation. It's just the church. I will say this as we wrap up. Some people will use this in a modern sense today and be like, see, this is the Bible advocating for like a political system like socialism or maybe even communist.

SPEAKER_01 32:07

Like saying, like you all you all have to share everything all the time. Right.

SPEAKER_02 32:10

But this is not that, this is generosity. Right. It's different because no one is dictating this. This is not the apostles demanding that they all sell their stuff and share equally. This is people of their own accord. Providing for the needs of the people. Saying, Hey, I I have plenty here. Yep. And that's that's actually what we experience as a church. I mean, everything we have here is is generosity. It is people going, I can do with less. And I and I trust my church, and I want to mainly, I think they say I want to honor the Lord. Right. And then hopefully they they trust the church to do well with it.

SPEAKER_01 32:42

So do you interpret the verse where it says, for as many were owners of lands or houses, sold them and brought the proceeds of what was sold in verse 34? Like, are you imagining that as like, you know, like landowners who have a house, but they also have like their Airbnb and they have like this land in North Georgia or whatever.

SPEAKER_02 33:03

Yeah, I think what it basically is saying is that the wealthy among them made themselves less wealthy. Right. So that others could have more. Because you have a s a society here that is mostly slaves. Most of the early followers of Jesus would have been, in the in the eyes of the Roman Empire, slaves. Which is more like an indentured payoff your debt for situation. There are no there are no banks. Right. So when you needed money to do something, you went to a person. I'm lending myself as collateral. Yes. And you don't own until that debt is paid off, you own nothing. It's like doing the dishes when you're dine and dash. Right. You get caught dying in dash.

SPEAKER_01 33:41

Which I don't know if that still happens in the city. Oh, it happens to me all the time.

SPEAKER_02 33:45

Like I'm so good at dishes. It's so I'm no it's so worth it. Yeah, it's like just an hour of dishes and I'm eating. Yeah. But yeah, it's that concept. And that's the whole political system of Rome is built on this. I mean, to be a citizen of Rome, you either had to be born a citizen or you serve in the military. Um, you know, there were other ways, but they're f few and far between, but you serve in the military for a long time, like 25 years, and then you get to be a citizen. Um, but yeah, so most of these people are very poor. And the the wealthy are going, I don't need all the that I have, and I can do with less.

SPEAKER_01 34:15

And that's where that when we talk about money, like that principle of the Old Testament tithe comes up. But the Christian reality is like it's about providing for each other and sharing life together and being there. So sometimes that's gonna mean for some people more than 10%. You know, 10% is the principle to express how much you should give or sac what sacrificial giving might feel like, but it is like this, and as many as we're with them, there wasn't a needy person there. Right.

SPEAKER_02 34:44

And so they were they were unwilling to tolerate someone not having food. You know what I mean? Right. And we should be as well. I agree. We really should be. We can be. Well, cool.

SPEAKER_01 34:53

Acts chapter four.

SPEAKER_02 34:54

Acts chapter four. And the next chapter's a doozy, so tune in next time. I haven't I haven't uh read ahead. I mean, I know the I know Acts, I just haven't Ananias and Sapphira.

SPEAKER_01 35:05

That's an easy one. I know it's easy, but no, it's it no, I'm saying it's one of those like challenging scriptures. Yeah, it takes a turn. All right, thanks guys for tuning in to the Bible study podcast. The BSP