SPEAKER_00 0:01

We had a few audio issues this morning, and Susan's mic didn't record clearly on this podcast. That said, what she and Steve shared is just awesome wisdom for all of our marriages, something we can all get a lot out of. So you may have to play with the volume a little bit as you listen, but it's definitely worth it.

SPEAKER_03 0:22

What side do you want? She's gonna pretend to let me drive. This will be good. Well, welcome everyone. It's great to be back together. If it's your first time here, hope you can tell that you can relax and be yourself. You picked an interesting morning um to to come. It's either gonna be a treat or a spectacle. If I start uh weeping and run out of the building, you'll always remember that Sunday at his hands. But what we're doing is we've we've taken kind of the summer, we're looking at the book of Proverbs and um God's wisdom, and it's just such life-changing stuff, and it's kind of different than man's wisdom and applies to all different areas of our life. And so three weeks ago we we got to marriage, and just some great wisdom and principles there. But it's really those principles really aren't enough to help us if we're struggling in our marriages, and because there's just so much more that God teaches about our relationships and our marriages. So we're taking two additional weeks. Last week Susan spoke, and then today we're gonna um share together and really try to provide more of uh of that. And my experience is that most of us, not all of us thankfully, but most of us struggle uh in our relationships uh either consistently or or at uh at different times. Uh we'll have been married 29 years in August. I'll scoot up a little bit.

unknown 1:56

I might live on that side if that's okay.

SPEAKER_03 1:59

Let's let's do that now.

unknown 2:00

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 2:01

She's gonna drive.

SPEAKER_01 2:04

I just need some room. That's all I'm saying. I just need some room, some things.

SPEAKER_03 2:08

Okay, so we've been married 29 years. How's that?

SPEAKER_01 2:11

You're gonna see it live and actually.

SPEAKER_03 2:13

Like I said, treat or spectacle. But um 29 years in August. I don't remember the exact date.

SPEAKER_01 2:22

I think it's uh memory's gone.

SPEAKER_03 2:27

It's toward the end of August. I know that. No, it's the 25th. Um but this is a big test because if we're still married next Sunday, we'll have made uh great, great progress. And you know, I say that because we've taken this week and we've really talked about and and thought back about some of the recurring issues that we faced in our relationship, and and what uh hopefully what you'll see is what Dallas shared is that Jesus can change our hearts and he can change our lives and and um changes our relationships. Uh, reliving some of those wasn't the most fun, but uh we do hope that it'll be helpful. So let's pray as we get started. Father, we just praise you. Thank you for being such a great God, for being our Abba Father, our daddy father, adopting us each as our own children. We're so thankful that you're not mad at us, you haven't given up on us, that uh you're for us, and we don't really deserve that, but we thank you so much for it. And Holy Spirit, thank you for being our teacher and counselor, and please teach each of us today, just even if you translate something, Susan or I say, that we could all leave with something in our heart that we know was uh from you. And Jesus, we just praise you for being our friend and our savior, and it's in your name we pray. Amen.

SPEAKER_01 3:43

I I love how he wrote it as notes, we better pray. That's what he wrote in his notes. We better pray because we're here's what's funny. For all you discerning types out there, you know, watching us even interact and try to work on something like this during like this whole week has been, it's very indicative of our marriage may look great. I don't know how it looks to y'all, it doesn't really matter. Because we're the ones living in it. But but this is the truth. We really do have a great marriage now, but that doesn't mean it's not challenging, that doesn't mean that we didn't fight this week about writing this message. How spiritual is that? Um, but Steve said, at least we didn't fight on the way here because we always take separate cars, because we have learned to walk in some wisdom over the years. But for anybody who was here last week, I shared really truly, I think both of us would agree, the number one thing that really changed our marriage for the better, and this sounds very simplistic, but without this foundation, it's really difficult to have a good marriage, is simply this. We looked for God, we opened ourselves up to God, and we started to be led by Him, and then we followed Him. And whatever He said, His ways, not our own. That is the foundation. That's like the number one thing that that really God gave us a great marriage and a great life from that. So who wants to hear number two? Number two, y'all be real shocked about this. The second thing that really helped us in our marriage was counseling. That sounds fun, doesn't it? Now, here's the thing, you might be surprised that we didn't go to marriage counseling because everybody's like, oh, we need marriage counseling for them. Like he pretty much wanted to take me to marriage counseling for me because I was really messed up, and I pretty much want to take him to marriage counseling for him. The truth was we went for marriage counseling, and for some reason, those counselors wanted to counsel us individually. And and I'm guessing they were pretty discerning or not that discerning because they could probably see that we both had issues. Well, we did that for a couple years, and for some reason our marriage got better. For some reason. Now I believe this only because I feel like we he may not agree with this, but you know, God shows you separate things even from your spouse and some things together. But this thing I feel like God showed me it's the 40-40-20 rule. Some of y'all might have heard me share that before. I truly believe this just because I lived it, that 40% of the problem in my marriage is my issues. I'm not gonna point at you, but 40% are his. And then I really think only about 20% is like the communication and the things where you don't agree on and all that kind of stuff. I really think it's your issues hitting their issues that really is the problem. So here's just picture this. If I got my 40%, now I'm not talking about perfection here, I'm talking about my 40% and my unhealthiness getting healthy. 40%, what would happen to our marriage with just that 40%? A lot. And when he gets his 40% or she gets her 40%, that's 80%, in case y'all can't add, it's like a miracle will happen in your marriage. You still may have the 20% of conflicts, but I think we could all say that'd be fine, right? Now, some of us in this room, like I said, want to take their spouse marriage counseling. Here's the truth about that. You can only deal with your 40%. You can't really deal with their 40%. That's between them and God. It's like our stuff is between us and God, their stuff is between them and God. And this is the truth, and I have learned this the hard way, and we're gonna talk about this in just a minute. I can't control him. I know he looks all laid back and everything like that, but he is feisty on the inside. That's all I have to say. Like you think I'm all intense and aggressive, trust me. He is way more than me, he's just quiet and nice about it. Um, but but I cannot control him, and unfortunately, I had to find out the hard way I cannot control him. Guess what? He can't control me either. Nor would we want to, and you're not you're y'all may think this is a little sacrilegious what I'm about to say. God can't control us either. Did you know that? He doesn't want to, we're not robots. He wanted children, not robots. So I guess I kind of look at it like that. If God can't control me or him, why would I try to control him? That's not my place. My place is to deal with my stuff. My stuff. And also after last week, I really felt a little remiss after the fact because I realized there's a lot of people in here who are not currently married, um, or they've gone through a divorce or anything like that. And I and I wanted to say last week, and I didn't say it, so I'm gonna take the opportunity to say now. If you're married, or you're not married, or it didn't work out, or it isn't working out currently, I just want you to know what I said last week. God really wants you to have a great life. Whether you're married or not married, He really wants you to have a great life. I hope that makes sense. It's a really good thing to work on having a great life together. That is a good thing. And it's hard, but it's worth it. It's good. But either way, God wants you to have a great life. So I don't I want that message to be for everybody. Okay, so speaking of control, since I brought that up, don't raise your hand. Anybody got issues with that? You know, half I'd say 75% of people would raise their hand on that one. When we went to counseling, um I realized that I had a problem with control, but it wasn't based in what you would think. It wasn't based in me being so dominant and so aggressive. It was actually based in fear and insecurity. And I knew I was insecure, um, partly because I was raised. Every thought in my life, pretty much every day of my whole life, was this. I'm a big nothing. I'm you're pretty aware that you're insecure if you think that every day of your life. I knew I was insecure. My picture was in the dictionary to the word insecure. Okay? That's how insecure I was. I didn't know that I had such a big problem with fear until it started getting revealed when I went to counseling. And what I realized when I went to the counseling was that every decision that I made in my life and with Steve was based in fear and insecurity. Every decision, every action I took, every word out of my mouth was pretty much based in fear and insecurity, not on good things like love or joy or peace. They weren't based on it. They were based on what I was, they were based on what I had been raised in. So now for the fun thing. One of the top five recurring fights I'm about to share with you. Top five. And I'm talking decades-long fights. I'm not talking like we had ten fights. I mean, we probably had how many on this one? A thousand? I don't know.

SPEAKER_03 11:06

Oh, sure.

SPEAKER_01 11:09

This is real.

SPEAKER_03 11:10

I thought you wanted me to open the fight. I didn't know you wanted the water.

SPEAKER_01 11:13

Don't bring that up again. I don't want to have that fight. Now you gotta laugh because even when we're working on this message, it's like, oh, that one. We gotta talk about that one, you know, and and we had a little different because this kid, he gets it. Okay. Here's what it was. This started really early on. Steve, I perceived him, I won't say that he was, I perceived him to be a workaholic. And I perceived that he would rather work at his job than spend time with me and the kids. And that was based on actual hours away from us. And he traveled a lot. But I will say this, I knew this. It was really important for him to provide well for us, and so he was doing this out of a noble place. He went up the ladder quickly, the corporate ladder quickly, he had all kinds of success. Everybody around him was just doing this. Whoa, you're awesome. He got a good salary, he had the admiration and respect of all his peers. And if I had been looking with eyes of love in him, remember what I said I was not looking with eyes of love, I was looking with eyes of fear and insecurity, and I'm like, whoa, whoa, whoa. If I had been looking with eyes of love, I probably would have joined his peers and telling him how great he was. And thank you for working so hard for me and the kids and for giving us a good life, and thank you for being that kind of man that does that. Sorry. But I was afraid. I was afraid. Because I needed to control my life, and I needed to control him as well. And it was out of fear and insecurity. These are the kind of things I wrote a few things down that I used to say in my mind and then out of my mouth in lots of different ways. I can make him spend time with me in the kids. It's my job. This was the big one right here. It's my job. Because I'm also spiritual. It's my job to make him be spiritually minded. Because he's out there working all the time, you know. I was worried he was gonna get all materialistic and all this kind of stuff and get all full of himself. It's my job to keep him humble. How does that feel to a man? Or to a woman for that matter? He's gonna get into his example in a minute.

SPEAKER_03 13:41

I'm gonna skip that.

SPEAKER_01 13:42

Don't skip that part.

unknown 13:43

It's really good. It's an awesome.

SPEAKER_01 13:47

But how does that feel to a man who is working so hard to try to make your life nice? And he, even if it's even if it's a little much, which it was, because of his issues. Well, he does have them. Um, it doesn't feel good at all. And let me just tell you the very thing that I wanted, which was for him to spend time with me and the kids and to know us and hang around us and be into us, the very thing that I wanted, what do you think I was causing? I was actually causing by my behavior and my actions towards him, not praising him, not admiring him, not respecting him. Everything I did caused the exact opposite of what I wanted. Do you know how far away he ran from me emotionally? We're already this far apart, and he just ran further. Physically, more time away from me. Because she's just gonna be like that dripping water in that Proverbs, the contentious woman, the nagging woman. That was me. I'm sorry.

SPEAKER_03 14:46

I don't think you've ever admitted that before. I have to.

SPEAKER_01 14:49

You lied. We talked about a lot this way. 1 John 4.18 says this God is love, and whenever we take up permanent residence in a life of love, we live in God and God lives in us. This way, love has the run of the house, becomes at home and mature in us, so that we're free of worry on judgment day. Our standing in the world is identical with Christ. There is no room in love for fear. Well-formed love banishes fear. Since fear is crippling, and in our life it was emotionally crippling. Since fear is crippling a fearful life, that was me, fear of death, fear of judgment is one not yet fully formed in love. Another version says, if we walk in fear, we haven't yet fully experienced his perfect love. So I want to skip ahead many, many years, but eventually I realized that I walked in fear and insecurity. Everything I every way that I treated Steve in regard to our marriage was out of fear and insecurity. But when I realized that was happening, I didn't want that anymore. And so I had to make the decision. I wish I had time to talk about this, I had to make the decision to not think like that anymore. I had to change all those negative thoughts every minute of the day into positive ones. And I needed God's help to do that. Woo! Because I had a lot of lies going on in there, a lot of lies, and I put them all on him. So that was a process that took years, but God had to help me. There was no way I could have figured that out or fixed it on my own at all. And what's really funny is when I started working, walking in more love and less fear, he started hanging around me more. It was weird. I actually got the thing. If I would have just done that um a couple of decades earlier, he might have actually wanted to spend time with me. And um, you want to share your story?

SPEAKER_03 16:45

Nope.

SPEAKER_01 16:47

I've got it right here. Steve, example of fear and insecurity. It's on my paper.

SPEAKER_03 16:54

Okay, so mine's actually even more embarrassing, but it's still it's the same thing. It's fear and insecurity. Um, so when we got married, you know, Susan's beautiful. She's actually more beautiful now, which I didn't think could happen, but apparently it does. It's your vision, though. No, that's not it. Um but I was actually real insecure about it, just about how attractive that uh she was. And I was a jail, and I was jealous, and um, and I was afraid that if somebody else was attracted to her, she would rather have that that somebody else. And so this fear and this insecurity and this jealousy, it just created a real controlling behavior. And uh and so it would be like, you know, this was a weekly contention over something, but it'd be like, you know, we'd be going out and then be like, boy, are you sure you want to wear that dress, or maybe you should wear tennis shoes instead of heels, or you know, not so much makeup, or all these like controlling things. And it's it's uh, you know, it could have been on Jerry Springer or something. But and but when you combine that with some things that happened to her as a child, it was devastating because it it made her feel impure, it made her feel really, really bad about herself, and and she wasn't impure, she was wonderful, but it was my fear and my insecurity and my trying to control her out of that. And so, of course, like all fears, you know. I mean, how do you think she was thinking? Before long, it's it's like, I mean, my fear is that she's gonna leave me, and before long, she's like, Man, I wish I could just be with someone who liked me how I am, who's not always trying to change me, who's happy with how God um created me. And, you know, it really took that personal counseling, you know, which was difficult for me. And it was something like, you know, I'd go and it'd be like, I don't know why she's acting this way, and they'd be like, Well, why does that make you so upset? And they'd be like, I don't know, which was always my answer. But eventually, eventually, between the Holy Spirit and that, you know, I could really see what was was motivating me, and I could see Susan for for how God created her. And, you know, and so as I repented to her, and as I changed, and as I relaxed, it just really, I guess, freed you up to to blossom into the person that God created you to be.

SPEAKER_01 19:46

I'm always like, are you scared what I'm gonna say when we're up there? He's like, No. The deep root of that problem with both of us. We just gave two examples, but I'm telling you, those literally were like the fights we had over and over, and they might have sounded a little different every time, but I mean, literally, they hurt us. Me not appreciating him, that hurt him deeply. Because one of his issues growing up with his parents was it was never good enough. So here I come into our marriage, and I'm saying, hey, guess what? It's never good enough. You know, and even what he did to me, I mean, it was it was brutal. We were so far away from each other. I mean, emotionally, physically, with resentment, bitterness built up. I mean, it was it was truly terrible. It was truly terrible. And the problem, the next thing we that was revealed to us, this was pretty early on in counseling, was hey, guess what? We're not supposed to get our basic core needs of life met from each other. There is no way, I was so messed up too when I got married and had nothing in me, nothing good. There was no way for him to fix that. And in a way, I was trying to get him to fix it for me. There is no way, and God has put built-in needs, and I don't care what counseling program you go to, what school you go to, they're gonna say God put four basic built-in needs in every single person. And here's what they are love, think about it, security, value, and purpose. There's no way for a human being to give you all those things totally and unconditionally. There is no way. Those are supposed to be met from God Himself, from God Himself. We can only give that to each other in human doses, not supernatural doses, in human doses, and God wants that for us, but we got to get the basic core part from him. And when we're young, our parents, and I mentioned this inferred a bit, our parents, they're the first representation of love, security, value, and purpose that is put into our life. And so if we've been neglected or uncared for or abused, um You have a deaf, and I'm just speaking from my own experience. You have like a big hole there for all that, and only God can heal that. I'm just telling you, only God can heal that. Luckily, it only took me like 15 or 20 years to realize that Steve was not going to be able to give me all those things. But I don't want Shaw to go 15 or 20 years to, and then you realize that. I'm telling you now, it's true. And what I realized that no matter what he thought about me, no matter if he loved me or he didn't love me, and it didn't even matter what I thought about myself, only God can meet those deep needs. Nothing I thought, nothing he thought, those weren't gonna fill those needs. It can only be from what God was giving me. And it took lots of years to really receive, because it was hard for me to receive love, security, value, and purpose. This was over years, so it's not like instantaneous, although you can get a lot, you can get a lot in one fell swoop. But this took years for me to get these things from God, and it was worth it. That's all I can say. I'm a different person because of that. But God did give Steve to me as a gift, and I hope vice versa, as a representation of his love for each other. I think that he gives us each other, um, especially in a marriage relationship, as a tangible expression of his love. And um and Steve has brought a lot of healing into my life now. I wasn't, I think God didn't want it to be like that at first because he wanted to be the one to heal me. I think the same for Steve. But now that we've both grown in God, it's like we bring healing to each other. When he says you are beautiful inside and out, you're perfect, you know, and he, you know, he says, I love who you are. When he says that, that is healing to me. I'm not gonna lie. It's a beautiful thing. But God needs to be the one to really give you the majority of that. That's just how it is. He also gives us each other for um, not just healing, but for growth. Growth. That's that iron sharpens iron. I'm pretty sure that's in Proverbs too. That is the painful, that's the painful thing. And this is the truth. Steve has helped me so much, um, and sometimes unfortunately, is by challenging me. And it makes me mad again. Like that enough? But the truth is, I always go away and I think about what he said, because usually he's right, and vice versa, too, right? Right. Same thing, same thing. Okay, yeah, yeah, yeah. But we we really have, and and I will tell you this it's I've heard someone say this before. It's not always an easy marriage that is the best marriage. We think perfection is easy and whatever is is the most enjoyable. I'm just gonna tell you something right now. Our life here on this planet is supposed to be at some level about growth. Because we're gonna take everything inside of us onto the next life, and so it's an awesome opportunity to grow and not just do this to the other person for their whole life. Receive what they have to say and use it to grow. God meant that for us as well. The next thing that God really showed us, actually, let me go ahead and read this verse, it'll kind of explain it. It's from John 4, and it says, This is so awesome, this is one of my favorites. It's who you are and the way you live that count before God. Your worship must engage your spirit in the pursuit of truth. That's the kind of people the Father is out looking for, those who are simply and honestly themselves before him in their worship. God is sheer being itself, spirit. And those who worship him will do it out of their very being, their spirits, their true selves in adoration. Do you know what that's saying? This is so wild. Who knew? You can be your real self in front of God. Guess what he already knows? He's saying this is what he wants. This is the kind of people he doesn't want a facade, he doesn't want people trying to be something they're not, he wants your real self coming before him as a child. How awesome is that? So I just have to assume that the next step from that, after you get that down, being your real self before God, is it's okay to be your real self before your spouse. And I believe other people as well. And that's even part of the vision here and his hands in general. How awesome is that that you can be real. We got that out on the sign sometimes. That means being your true self, your real self. And here's the next part and know you are loved. Be your true self, your real self, and still know you are loved. That's what God showed us. And I think some marriage books call that intimacy. I just call it being known completely and then still being loved completely. How awesome is that? And that was something that God showed us that we both had the desire, but we were so afraid if we showed the other person what was really inside, they would reject us. That took years for us to get to that point where we can open ourselves up. We're still a little scared sometimes and be vulnerable and let them see every bad thought we're thinking, and then still know we'll be accepted and loved. And that that's been huge, and that's been a real blessing. But then it took us, like I said, decades to be able to risk that and get past that. All right, Ephesians 5, 1 through 2. We've read this many times. Watch what God does, and then you do it, like children who learn proper behavior from their parents. And mostly what God does is love you. That's so awesome. Keep company with him and learn a life of love. Observe how Christ loved us. His love was not cautious, but extravagant. He didn't love in order to get something from us, but to give everything of himself to us. Love like that. Do you hear that? Not this is he's saying, love like this. Learn to love like this from me. Not cautiously. That's how me and Steve did it. We were cautious. I'm not gonna give him too much praise or extravagant love because then he might, like he thought, want something different than me. Extravagantly. And not trying to get some need met in ourselves, but to help them get whatever need they have is met in them. Okay, so that sounds all wonderful. Everything's perfect, everything's easy in our life now, right? I will say this. Woo! Leaps and bounds. I don't even, I don't even know if I can stretch my arms smart enough to show how far it's come because it was so terrible and now it's really quite wonderful. But I will say this conflicts still happen. Darn. And this is the truth. When that happens, I go back into my old habits, which is aggressively attack him. I won't physically show you what that looks like, but it's aggressive. And and then here's what happens the force build goes up.

unknown 29:31

Woo!

SPEAKER_01 29:32

Otherwise, anybody relate to that? The brick wall around a person, that's that's Steve's. He doesn't aggressively attack, he's like, I'm gonna put that brick wall up. And so what happened is we were still operating in that every time a conflict would occur, and and one day Steve said something to me. Now I know God told him this, even though he's pretty smart. I'm pretty sure God showed him this, and it changed, it was like a paradigm shift in our marriage. And so I'm gonna let him share what that was.

SPEAKER_03 30:01

What he uh what he showed is pretty simple, and I think it's like what Susan's talking about they're just both important. You know, getting that personal inner healing, getting past our wounds and our hurts, and so we can we can interact. Um but what he said is that we're a team. I know that sounds uh ridiculously simple. Um the Bible would call it, say that we are one. Um in Ephesians 5.30 it says, and this is why a man leaves father and mother and cherishes his wife. No longer two, they become one flesh. This is a huge mystery, and I don't pretend to understand it all. What is clearest to me is the way Christ treats the church, and this provides a good picture of how each husband is to treat his wife, loving himself and loving her, and how each wife is to honor her husband. If there's an obstacle, it's kind of the big, I guess, uh, plague on mankind. Uh for everyone, it's just selfishness. You know, what am I getting out of this? You know, are my needs being met? Am I carrying more of the weight or the responsibility? Why do her issues have to affect me and the other way around? So I don't know really remember when or where this revelation happens.

SPEAKER_01 31:13

I'm gonna show you. I like visuals. Okay, this is the this is what Steve did to be. We only got so much time. He's like, Yeah, we're not gonna go long. Okay. Anyway, um, I remember the first time I started doing this, we got into a conflict, even though things were better between us, and I started just being like, rah, just aggressively. I mean, I might even have been doing like this on his chest or something like that, you know, screaming at the top of my lungs.

SPEAKER_03 31:35

And he hit me over the head with a toaster or something.

SPEAKER_01 31:38

Yeah. But he he literally came up to me. Do you want to show?

SPEAKER_03 31:41

Sure.

SPEAKER_01 31:41

And this is what he did. He actually held my arms down kind of a little bit, and he goes, Hey, hey, hey. We're on the same team. And it literally made me just go like that. I just dropped, it made me feel like crying, and I just dropped. And and and I mean, from that day on, he has used that method many times. And it always works.

SPEAKER_03 32:02

It does work. It always works. And it's not just holding her arms down, it's actual um Although that prevents injury. It does, keeps us all safe. Um but the thing is that we're we we really are a team. God's put us together as a team. And so when we have individual issues, like when I was drinking too much, it wasn't um Susan against me and me drinking too much. It was me and Susan against drinking too much. And when she fought depression and anger, it wasn't me against Susan and her depression and her anger. It was Susan and I as a team against the depression and the anger. That we are um a team. And we all have strengths, you know, and we all have weak weaknesses. And I'm not saying that every type of weaknesses we can tolerate in a marriage, because some uh we can, but most of them we can, and we can both compensate for, and we can just heal and strengthen and and and work together as a team. And uh one example, and this is pretty shallow compared to some of the stuff we're talking about, but I was raised and I was taught that that in the family the man was supposed to handle the money. You know, and so that's what I did. And that worked pretty well until the third time our water got cut off, I think. And um and the thing is, God wired me, so I'm uh I think well as far as big picture finance and things like that, but I either won't or I can't, or whatever it is, balance a checkbook. And you know, I had this whole system, you pay the pink ones, throw the rest away, and uh it just wasn't working out. And Susan doesn't enjoy paying bills, but but she's willing to do it, and she's great at it. And so since she started handling that, you know, away from my preconceived notions of how our relationship was supposed to work, it's just gone great. Um and and it what it did is it made our team strong. You know, our team was weak because I felt like I had to be in that role, but now it's a complete reversal. I mean, that area of our life, we haven't had, I don't know, a late payment in years. And so our team is strong. Um and it's uh it's so helpful when we have differences. A lot of times we think of differences are the source of our problems. Really, differences are the source of a strength. You know, the real troubled relationships that that I see are the ones where where the couple is so much alike. You know, they have these huge blind spots and they have these huge areas where neither of them can can fill. So they have to go out and try to get some outside help or do something to to be uh stronger as a team. But thankfully, opposites do attract. So often we have a lot of differences when we go into um a relationship. And that's not a weakness, it's a huge strength. It's something that we should embrace and we should be thankful for it. And it can be in all simple, you know, I mean all different ways. Like um early on, and we've kind of we're on the same page now, but but before, you know, like to me, vacation seemed like uh a moderate waste of money. You know, and so I'd really we would have to budget and plan and and and try to work it in. Susan would live at Caribbean Beach Resort at Disney World if she could. Um I mean she would go all the time. And and but the healthy thing is somewhere right in between. You know, let's not have financial chaos and and just go on a whim. Let's figure it out, let's plan. But man, it's so important to get away and to restore and rejuvenate. And so because we have this opposite, eventually we're able to come into a really good um balance. And it'd be the same like going out when I was working too much. You know, I never wanted to go out, I always wanted to stay at home. She always wanted to go out, and so it's a source of big advice. But the truth is there's some healthy balance right there in the middle that these differences have got us together. So as a team, individually we might not be balanced, but it doesn't matter because we're a team. And so as a team, we're strong. As a team, um we're we're balanced. Easily one of the biggest and and uh I guess most recurring confrontations we had um was with my parents. And um really my value in my parents' opinion equal to Susan's. Now, this is something some of us are gonna be able to relate to because it's kind of a deep issue. And so my thing was, you know, Ten Commandments, I want to honor my father and mother, and and all that type of stuff. And I didn't read the verse we just read, which is, and this is why a man leaves father and mother. Let me say it again. And this is why a man leaves father and mother and cherishes his wife. No longer two, they become one flesh. And so Susan and my parents had have, I'd say, an okay relationship at best. Now, part of that is because we were raised in a very legalistic church, and leaving a church like that is like leaving a cult. It's a huge deal. And because they raised me, I could have never done that myself. Um, it had to be her. And so they blame her for that. And um and also, honestly, she's a a stronger woman than they're used to. And so the role I took on was a combination of peacemaker and unbiased arbitrator. And so if there was a disagreement about maybe how when my parents were gonna come visit, how long they're gonna stay, where they're gonna stay, what we're gonna do, it could be, you know, it could be anything. My position was whatever I thought what the middle ground was, or whatever I thought was right. And um, see, I was just so stupid because I forgot, I forgot I had been promoted to a different team. Susan and I were the team now. You know, and sometimes one of our our spouses might be acting badly in a in a parental spouse situation. Um, but it's still us maybe against that attitude, like I talked about before. Um but the real problem is we can't see correctly. When I was trying to play unbiased arbitrator, um, I couldn't see correctly because I was still trying to please my parents. You know, and so when I thought I was being maybe down the middle, I really wasn't, because there's part of me that was trying to to please um my parents. And so same sort of stuff. God and some counseling and the Holy Spirit and a nudge or two from Susan, and it got a lot more bounced about with that. Um but it's an emotionally charged issue, you know, because it because it can cause deep resentment and bitterness, you know, because we want our spouse to to well, it's just it's how God created it. So if we get outside that, it's it's not gonna work well. Um and so Susan and I, so those of you who are parents with grown children, this may help. Otherwise, I'm about done. Um but uh Susan and I are married, and so we're the team now. And so we appreciate my parents, you know, we're good to my parents, we're respectful to my parents, but they can't disrespect Susan ever. Uh they don't get to decide how we discipline our children, or really anything in our lives. You know, we need advice sometimes, and if we need it, we'll ask for it. Otherwise, I've left father and mother, I cherish my wife. I've left father and mother, I cherish my husband. You know, we are the team. And it should be that way across the board. It could be friends, it could be family, it could be loved ones, it could be business associates. Other than our relationship with God, this relationship trumps all of them. We're on the same team. And so it's us together against our problems, it's our differences that make us strong. Um and finally, and quickly, hey, by the way, we're gonna do something different this morning. We're not gonna do a last song like we always do, because we knew we were gonna be long and we wanted to get all this in. And so when we get done, we'll pray and then we'll do uh hands in the pile. But what I want to share is just how unique and wonderful a team can be. In Ephesians 2.10, it says, For we are God's masterpiece. He has created us anew in Christ Jesus, so we can do the good things he planned for us long ago. There's no two of us that are the same. You are God's masterpiece. He created you individually with great care. You're unique. Susan's unique. There's not another woman alive that's ever been alive like Susan or like me. And so our relationship is going to be unique. There's not going to be another marriage anywhere, anytime that looks exactly like our relationship. And the mistake that I think that we made and is easy to make is we try to fit this unique masterpiece into some mold, force it into a mold. And that mold can come from our parents, it can come from our culture, it can come from religion. When we did a marriage class, I had brought in a bunch of this fruit. And the idea is that God created all this fruit beautiful. And so if we were going to arrange it into this beautiful whatever fruit tray, you know, we wouldn't smash it together into some preconceived shape, and then all we'd have is a big glump of something, you know, or for the men, a turduccin. Okay, you're not going to take a turkey, a duck, and a chicken and run it through the sausage grinder. You're going to carefully place it, arrange it, and smoke it. Um so the parents thing is easy to understand. It's sometimes hard to wind up. And that's just that we grow up with these preconceptions, you know, of what a marriage should look like. And that's our our parents' unique relationship. And so we can't necessarily force that on ourselves. You know, it might be that uh this is stereotypical, but but say uh my mom showed her love for the family by by cooking all the time, you know, and and if I marry someone who who actually Susan's a great cook, but doesn't want to cook all the time, you know, then that can be a point of contention. It could be that uh it could be that I was raised by a dad who wasn't very physically affectionate, you know, and so that's my mold. But but that's no, you know, our our our spouses and our kids need that. So we got to break out of that mold and ask God, what's the unique masterpiece that uh he created us to be and for in our relationship to be? So we just can't jam ourselves in the mold. It might come from our parents, it might come from our culture. You know, if you've ever gone to a street of dreams, Susan and I used to do this on Sunday afternoon. You'd they'd have a whole street and all the homes would be uh be decorated, you know, and you'd go and then you go through the homes and you get home, and it's like, man, our house is horrible. I used to call it the Avenue of Discontent because it's like we don't have a walk-in refrigerator, what's wrong with us? You know, our we don't have a home theater with a popcorn machine. This is horrible. And and uh so it's the same way when we compare our spouses to to culture, like Hollywood, you know? It it's you know that that that same happy wife in the movies is the woman with a string of broken relationships, you know, in real life. And, ladies, there aren't any handsome, rich men that punch out people all the time that love to dance and write poetry about their wives. And so those are all molds that we can see and we can kind of work our way out of. But the mold that can be the most destructive really is religion. And this is true in general. It doesn't just apply to marriages because with religion there comes another thing of this is what God says. You know? And so it's just a whole bigger, stronger thing. And what I want to share real quickly is going to be a no-brainer for some of you. It's going to be a stretch from others. And like everything, we don't really have to agree, but perhaps you could just consider it. And that is that the Bible historically has been taught by men and who are just people. You know, and so when teaching, you tend to pick out stories and verses that might fit your preconception or what you want to teach. And it might not be the whole picture, it might not be in context at all. And over time, women really have been dismissed in a lot of religious circles or been asked to be forced into a specific personality type. Now in the Old Testament, there were judges. This was before there were ever kings. In fact, God never intended there to be kings. That's something the people demanded and eventually he relented. But he wanted a judge that ruled the entire nation, and he would speak to that judge, and then the judge would lead the nation. And so in Judges chapter 4, uh the once again Israel's turned away from God, and the Canaanites are attacking and terrorizing the people, and the people cry out for a judge. And it says that God raised up a judge, and her name was Deborah. And Deborah was married, and she was the judge over all of Israel. God told her exactly what to do, and then she would tell the people what to do. And she ended up leading them into battle. Israel won that battle, it was a landmark victory. And Sisera, who was the commander of the opposing force, fled. And a woman named Jael found him in his tent and drove a tent peg through his head and killed him. A few chapters later, there's a guy named Abimelech who's terrorizing the Israelites. And a woman up in a tower drops a big stone right on his noggin and problem solved there. And there are plenty. You notice how if you read the one year Bible and you go through and like all the time, you're like, whoa, I didn't know that was in the Bible. Because there's a lot of things that that aren't necessarily the topic that would be talked about here or anywhere else. But there's lots of historic, I mean heroic and strong women in both the Old Testament and the New Testament. Women played a very prominent role in the New Testament. Elizabeth and Mary are two of the most obvious. After Jesus is born, they take him into the temple for the first time, and it's the prophetess Anna that recognizes Jesus as the Messiah and blesses him. Jesus' ministry was supported financially by prominent women. In Luke 8, it says, Soon afterward Jesus began a tour of the nearby towns and villages, preaching and announcing the good news about the kingdom of God. He took his twelve disciples with him, along with some women who had been cured of evil spirits and diseases. Among them were Mary Magdalene, from whom he had cast out seven demons, Joanna, the wife of Chezah, Herod's businessmanner, Susanna and manager, Susanna, and many others who were contributing from their own resources to support Jesus and his disciples. Jesus made it a huge point to include women in what was an extremely chauvinistic society. And so when Jesus would tell a parable, often he would tell a male parable and then a female parable. So it would be the man that lost his sheep, and then it would be the woman who lost her coin. You know, it would be him talking to the Samaritan woman at the well. It'd be him talking to the defending the woman that was caught sleeping with uh with another guy. Um it was women at the cross, it was women that first saw Jesus when he came out of the tomb. It was women on the day of Pentecost. It was women in the early church. This is one short section and one letter to the Romans. It's Romans 16, starting verse 1. I commend to you our sister Phoebe, who is a deacon in the church in Centria. Welcome her in the Lord. I think I'm gonna say that slower. I welcome, I commend you to our sister Phoebe, who is a deacon in the church in Centria. Welcome her in the Lord as one who is worthy of honor among God's people. Help her in whatever she needs, for she has been helpful to many and especially to me. Give my greetings to Priscilla and Aquila, my co-workers in the ministry of Christ Jesus. In fact, they once risked their lives for me. I'm thankful to them, and so are all the Gentile churches. Also give my greetings to the church that meets in their home. Greet my dear friend Epineetus. He was the first person from the province of Asia to become a follower of Christ. Give my greetings to Mary, who has worked so hard for your benefit. Greet Adronicus and Junia. Junia is a female name, so that Junia is a woman. Greet Adronicus and Junia, my fellow Jews, who were in prison with me. They are highly respected among the apostles and became followers of Christ before I did. Acts 17, 4 says, Some of the Jews who listened were persuaded and joined Paul and Silas along with many God-fearing Greek men and quite a few prominent women. Religion, not God, not Jesus, religion has dismissed the ability and strength and intelligence and leadership qualities in women and tried to force them in a mold that might be different than the unique masterpiece that God created you to be. And um we just don't want to let anyone decide what the mold for our unique relationship is gonna be. We want to have a relationship where we both can grow into the people that God created us to be. And so we don't want to let our parents, we don't want to let our culture, and we don't want to let religion tell us what that team needs to look like. In Proverbs 25, it says, the purposes of a person's heart are deep waters, but one who has insight draws them out. And so we can draw those deep waters out from each other. You know, really get to know each other. I asked Susan the other day, I said, um, this isn't really like me, but um, I said, man, tell me something bad about yourself that you don't want me to know. And she didn't. But the uh I don't think so, but I'm you probably can't think of anything. I could do it right now. No, that's okay. But but the point is I want to know, I want to know all of her the good, the bad. You know, I just want to know her and uh and love her for her who she is, and then we can help each other on building each other up where we need to be. We were out of town this last week and and she read a review of a book in the newspaper, and um, and the book was basically a huge survey of people who had been divorced and asking them what they would do differently. And they came up with five main things. And one of the five was to really get to know each other. And it suggested taking 10 minutes every day, and I've kind of put this on my goal list, but uh to take 10 minutes every day and talk about something that's not financial, that's not kids related, that's not schedule related, you know, just kind of drawing the deep waters out, as Proverbs would say, Really getting to know each other. Um, you know, if you if we could take a trip anywhere, where would it be? You know, what what is one of your fears or or one of your greatest memories as a child or whatever it is? Just talking, really getting to know each other. Susan I made a list this week of places that we would like to go together and and restaurants we'd like to eat at together. And you know, I didn't know some of them, you know, and she didn't know some of mine. And so it was a small thing, but we got to know each other better and we got stronger, you know, therefore as a team. And so I guess I would just say I just want to encourage you. You know, I our hope would be that when you leave, um, when you get in your car, you would want to look at each other if you're married and say, you know what, we're a team. We are a team. God's made us a team, a unique team, a masterpiece separate, a masterpiece together. You know, let's figure out, let's ask him to show us what that um can be. And we can have a fresh start in our relationships anytime. Isaiah 43, it says, but the Lord says, Do not cling to events of the past or dwell on what happened long ago. Watch for the new thing I'm going to do. Watch for the new thing I'm gonna do. It is happening already. You can see it now. I will make a road through the wilderness and give you streams of water there.

SPEAKER_01 54:26

That's one of my favorite verses. The one I like called old King James, behold, I'm doing a new thing. God says. And I think that's for us today. Don't dwell on the former things, the things of the past. Behold, I'm doing a new thing, even though you might not be able to see it right now. I'm gonna make a way in the desert and streams in the wilderness. I mean, that's pretty awesome. Let's just pray and then we're gonna finish with hands on the top. God, I just thank you that you are so generous and that you love us so much. God, I just ask you to help us be the strong and the unique teams that you've designed us to be. God, I thank you that you want to help us have great lives and you want to help us have great marriages. So we ask you to come on in. We invite you in, fill us up with your spirit. Lead us and guide us every day, God. Help us not to walk in fear anymore, but to walk in love the way that you love, God. And we tell you that we love you.